Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Discuss the legendary band Morbid Angel here. For fifteen years The Chapel has connected the widest morbid fanbase online.
zim
Postwhore
Posts: 20401
Joined: 14 Apr 2009, 02:36
Location: US

Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby zim » 18 Oct 2017, 04:07

http://www.ztmag.com/blog/news/morbid-a ... -reviewed/
When you’re a band with a legacy like Morbid Angel, you’re cursed to have your latest work compared to your other albums. So let’s answer the question that everyone’s asking: yes, this is much better than their last release Illud…

Kingdoms Disdained is squarely a death metal album from a death metal band who have made a huge effort to get back to what they do best: make crazed, evil, sick songs. It is one of their darker efforts, with little of the psychedelia of Heretic or the cheesiness of Illud…. Even their tendency to include pointless instrumentals has been curbed. This is a leaner, more fruital work.

They have returned to their counter-intuitive style of songwriting (tapping along to these is challenging) and the arrangements are extremely busy. The only straightforward 4/4 track is ‘Declaring New Law’, but it helps that the lyrics are about genocide and torture, not Transformer dolls. Steve Tucker is in great form, and demonstrates that a stock-standard yet passionate frontman can eclipse an uninspired legend. He sounds particularly feral on ‘The Righteous Voice’. Scott Fuller has slipped comfortably into Sandoval’s shoes and has a couple of extra tricks up his sleeve, such as the gravity blast at the start of ‘D.E.A.D’. Trey has returned to his demented style of soloing – again, with any indulgent tendencies largely trimmed – and I suspect the saucy melodic solo at the end of ‘Declaring New Law’ is newcomer Dan Vadim Von.

So is this a classic? No.

The production suffers from trying to be TOO fruital. It’s not the catastrophe that Heretic was but all the guitar work is buried. This is a huge shame, because the riffs on this album are fantastic. What I can hear has me scrambling for the EQ. ‘Gardens of Disdain’ and ‘Piles of Little Arms’ have great verses…when you can hear them. ‘Architect and Iconoclast’ in particular suffers, its enormous unique chords barely discernable. One can only wonder how far this album could have soared with a powerful, balanced mix pushing the melodies. Instead, it feels cold and flat and makes some of the more subtle work drag.

The album is still growing on me and despite the immediate payoff of tracks like ‘For No Master’, feels like it will be a slow burner. Old fans will be pleased ["stroke me, for i wish to orgasm", maybe… – The Ed], Illud… fans will be astonished, but I have no idea what others will make of this.

sam bean 4/6
Kingdoms Disdained is released on 1 December 2017 via Silver Lining Music
User avatar
H4T3M4CH1N3
God of Emptiness
Posts: 659
Joined: 03 Jul 2011, 07:07
Location: Place Of Many Deaths

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby H4T3M4CH1N3 » 18 Oct 2017, 06:37

Summary: Erik Rutan throwing good stuff to the litter with his style of producing and shit.
Wide open 'til you see God, then BRAKE!.

Kevin Schwantz #34 - Team Suzuki Lucky Strike
User avatar
Rufus T. Firefly
Metal God
Posts: 16615
Joined: 16 Apr 2009, 08:49

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Rufus T. Firefly » 18 Oct 2017, 10:09

so Beany just threw Rutan under the bus :redneck:
Image
User avatar
Nick
Postwhore
Posts: 49979
Joined: 26 Jul 2009, 22:32
Location: the bottle dump

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Nick » 18 Oct 2017, 11:04

Seems like it
vega wrote:But when I am meeting she is a round circle like egg. :oldryan: . She is eating 88% of foods and I am paying 100% bill.


Ninny wrote:But I've never seen a fat sexy leopard elevator naked, what do I do when I'm not aroused?
User avatar
iamgoat
Metal God
Posts: 5814
Joined: 13 Apr 2009, 14:44
Location: a mountain somewhere

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby iamgoat » 18 Oct 2017, 11:20

FYI, a production is not the same thing as a mix.

A production is the recording of a performance of an arrangement of a song.

I believe you mean to say that the songs suffer from how it's mixed.

You also need to understand that mixing a record is not a one-way street. Perhaps Rutan's first mix was different (probably) and Trey guided him more towards what Trey wanted to hear. The band needs to sign off on the mix before it heads to mastering so in other words, you can't blame the engineer when you weren't there with him in the studio or were in some other way informed of the happenings there.

What we hear now is the outcome of a collaboration between an artist, an engineer and a producer (the latter being the same person in this regard). So to be fair, Rutan or any other producer and/or engineer, is never 100% accountable or responsible for the quality of the work a band puts out. It is literally in the hands of everybody involved.

I needed to make this clear. :santa:

Personally, I was always a fan of the work that Tom and Jim Morris of Morrissound put out. Their metal days were legendary and their mixes really sounded amazing.
:grimb:
User avatar
Uni777
Ancient One
Posts: 1405
Joined: 17 Apr 2009, 02:23
Location: Killa cult cult Killa Killa cult cult

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Uni777 » 18 Oct 2017, 12:46

Just like Heretic's mix was Trey's vision and not what Punchy would have done if given the choice.
I think Erik followed Trey's mandate to the letter here. Dark, moody and underground. Drums sound as snappy as Trey would likely prefer remebering previous comments in interviews about that. It doesn't sound like a typical Rutan mix to me.
It does sound like MA. Much more to me than the Metal songs on the album which shall not be named. Shame about the buried guitars though.
User avatar
iamgoat
Metal God
Posts: 5814
Joined: 13 Apr 2009, 14:44
Location: a mountain somewhere

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby iamgoat » 18 Oct 2017, 14:51

One thing that is kind of a signature in Rutan's mixes is the bassguitar sound and how it sits in the mix. I really like that.
:grimb:
User avatar
Ninny
Metal God
Posts: 11813
Joined: 13 Apr 2009, 15:24
Location: Groaningagain

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Ninny » 18 Oct 2017, 18:08

If Beany has the CD he should tell us more, maybe something about packaging or writing credits :santa:
User avatar
iamgoat
Metal God
Posts: 5814
Joined: 13 Apr 2009, 14:44
Location: a mountain somewhere

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby iamgoat » 18 Oct 2017, 20:17

Ninny wrote:If Beany has the CD he should tell us more, maybe something about packaging or writing credits :santa:


He probably has a promo, that's just a little paper sleeve for the cd that's been printed. If it is the actual jewelcase then it's not really a promo haha.
:grimb:
User avatar
H4T3M4CH1N3
God of Emptiness
Posts: 659
Joined: 03 Jul 2011, 07:07
Location: Place Of Many Deaths

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby H4T3M4CH1N3 » 19 Oct 2017, 02:22

iamgoat wrote:FYI, a production is not the same thing as a mix.

A production is the recording of a performance of an arrangement of a song.

I believe you mean to say that the songs suffer from how it's mixed.

You also need to understand that mixing a record is not a one-way street. Perhaps Rutan's first mix was different (probably) and Trey guided him more towards what Trey wanted to hear. The band needs to sign off on the mix before it heads to mastering so in other words, you can't blame the engineer when you weren't there with him in the studio or were in some other way informed of the happenings there.

What we hear now is the outcome of a collaboration between an artist, an engineer and a producer (the latter being the same person in this regard). So to be fair, Rutan or any other producer and/or engineer, is never 100% accountable or responsible for the quality of the work a band puts out. It is literally in the hands of everybody involved.

I needed to make this clear. :santa:

Personally, I was always a fan of the work that Tom and Jim Morris of Morrissound put out. Their metal days were legendary and their mixes really sounded amazing.


Whatever. This still sounds to me like CC's "Kill", Rutan's own HE (Pretty much everything since "I, Monarch"): Massive wall of sound obliterating every subtle nuance
Wide open 'til you see God, then BRAKE!.

Kevin Schwantz #34 - Team Suzuki Lucky Strike
User avatar
iamgoat
Metal God
Posts: 5814
Joined: 13 Apr 2009, 14:44
Location: a mountain somewhere

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby iamgoat » 19 Oct 2017, 04:59

I think Kill had a very organic fresh sound. Old school too. But yeah, there's always a lot of fruital low end. Sometimes too much.
:grimb:
User avatar
User
Metal God
Posts: 8714
Joined: 14 Aug 2014, 13:18
Location: Unknown

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby User » 19 Oct 2017, 20:57

why didn't beany publish this on mabb

zero tolerance is so 2003
more metal
User avatar
Shredlord
Ancient One
Posts: 1617
Joined: 16 Apr 2009, 20:07

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Shredlord » 19 Oct 2017, 23:21

"gravity blast."--oh my...
zim
Postwhore
Posts: 20401
Joined: 14 Apr 2009, 02:36
Location: US

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby zim » 19 Oct 2017, 23:32

i am a fan of gravity blasts but i don't think pete ever did one on a ma song
User avatar
Taurean Mixing
God of Emptiness
Posts: 527
Joined: 17 Apr 2009, 10:08
Contact:

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Taurean Mixing » 19 Oct 2017, 23:37

zim wrote:i am a fan of gravity blasts but i don't think pete ever did one on a ma song

nope he never did
User avatar
morbid board eli
Postwhore
Posts: 68743
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 07:36

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby morbid board eli » 20 Oct 2017, 00:24

samb ean
User avatar
morbid board eli
Postwhore
Posts: 68743
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 07:36

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby morbid board eli » 20 Oct 2017, 00:25

Shredlord wrote:"gravity blast."--oh my...


phpBB [video]
User avatar
Verbal
Postwhore
Posts: 20730
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 03:05

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Verbal » 20 Oct 2017, 01:32

im guessing its whatever shit happens at about 1:50?
User avatar
Shredlord
Ancient One
Posts: 1617
Joined: 16 Apr 2009, 20:07

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Shredlord » 20 Oct 2017, 02:33

Verbal wrote:im guessing its whatever shit happens at about 1:50?

Gravity blast is about 2 or 4 times the speed of standard blast.

This drummer demonstrates the various types:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4KNXi-SWWc

(I forgot the code for embedding a video...)
User avatar
Verbal
Postwhore
Posts: 20730
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 03:05

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Verbal » 20 Oct 2017, 03:49

i dont know what a standard blast is

it all just sounds like drums
User avatar
Verbal
Postwhore
Posts: 20730
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 03:05

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Verbal » 20 Oct 2017, 03:56

and are we all just going to pretend that "fruital" is a word?
User avatar
Nick
Postwhore
Posts: 49979
Joined: 26 Jul 2009, 22:32
Location: the bottle dump

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Nick » 20 Oct 2017, 04:40

It is on mabb
vega wrote:But when I am meeting she is a round circle like egg. :oldryan: . She is eating 88% of foods and I am paying 100% bill.


Ninny wrote:But I've never seen a fat sexy leopard elevator naked, what do I do when I'm not aroused?
User avatar
iamgoat
Metal God
Posts: 5814
Joined: 13 Apr 2009, 14:44
Location: a mountain somewhere

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby iamgoat » 20 Oct 2017, 04:53

Silly gravity blasts. Stupid name too.
:grimb:
User avatar
TamPron
Metal God
Posts: 16567
Joined: 24 Apr 2009, 00:50
Location: Rod Stewart
Contact:

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby TamPron » 20 Oct 2017, 06:13

Here's his track by track breakdown:

Pile of Little Arms (a reference to one of Col.Kurtz's speech in Apocalypse Now, also used as the intro sample for 'In the Graveyard of God' by Australia BM band Bestial Warlust ): you've heard it ;)

D.E.A.D:
Starts with gravity blasting and dissonance. Very WTF song, short and pretty avant garde.

Garden of Disdain:
Great verse riff, which gets hidden in the mix. As a result, the song seems to drag out a bit. Feels kind of like Nothing is Not

The Righteous Voice:
After the ‘gateways’-style opening, gets pretty old school. Sounds kinda Hate Eternal now I think about it. Great vox performance on this one. VERY Trey solo, very demented. Gets more evil the more it goes on.

Architect and Iconoclast:
Hints of interesting guitar chords, but hidden under production. Great tom roll groove leitmotif, and the song writing is another level up. Again the production reduces some of the guitar moments that should be jaw-dropping.

Paradigms Warped:
The groove grows on you. Didn't think much of the live footage but the album version makes sense. Trey has a new style of chord-usage on this album that crops up.

The Pillars Crumbling:
Busy opening riffs, great groove to it. Has a totally bizarre, almost heavy-metal Chuck Berry ending

For No Master:
Most evil sounding track on the album. Pure Morbid and quite catchy.

Declaring New Law:
Probably the closest to Destructos on Illud in terms of its 4/4 rock beat but with evil lyrics and some 'tricky' rhythm guitars. This kind of thing actually works when it’s not dripping with cheese. Good melodic solo outro - I imagine it'd be either Vadim or Erik.

From the Hand of Kings:
fruital. Sounds kinda Hate Eternal-ish again. Great blissful Trey solo. He's kind of found his knack again of taking shards of melody and feeling but coming at it from a chaotic direction.

The Fall of Idols:
Another blaster, with crazed Trey solos (the first one is Altars-ish). God only knows what they’re playing under the blasting though.
zim
Postwhore
Posts: 20401
Joined: 14 Apr 2009, 02:36
Location: US

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby zim » 20 Oct 2017, 07:06

Verbal wrote:im guessing its whatever shit happens at about 1:50?


no doofus, that's called an 808 drop, the gravity blast is at 0:48

gravity blasts are cool my dudes :bang:
User avatar
iamgoat
Metal God
Posts: 5814
Joined: 13 Apr 2009, 14:44
Location: a mountain somewhere

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby iamgoat » 20 Oct 2017, 17:15

IMO, No they're not. There's nothing b rutal about it. It's just super fast. Wooptiedoo.
:grimb:
User avatar
Taurean Mixing
God of Emptiness
Posts: 527
Joined: 17 Apr 2009, 10:08
Contact:

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Taurean Mixing » 20 Oct 2017, 17:25

I like them used sparingly, like spice. Not all the time, consistently.
User avatar
morbid board eli
Postwhore
Posts: 68743
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 07:36

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby morbid board eli » 20 Oct 2017, 17:35

iamgoat wrote:IMO, No they're not. There's nothing b rutal about it. It's just super fast. Wooptiedoo.


you have become burned out on brutality :eyes:
User avatar
Shredlord
Ancient One
Posts: 1617
Joined: 16 Apr 2009, 20:07

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Shredlord » 20 Oct 2017, 22:39

I think these techniques would result in better guitar sound for death metal bands:

1) Reduce the gain in the pre-amp stage of guitar amps by about 25% so the tone is less saturated and more articulate.
2) Crank the amp to beyond stage volume so the power amp provides more of the tone--it would be more "muscular" and again, more articulate.
3) Place the mics 2-3 feet from the guitar cabs instead of nearly touching the grill cloth so they pick up the sound of the entire cabinet, not just one small area of a speaker cone.

There's not a lot of point in writing complex, busy riffs or chording if they are reduced to a buzzy noise.
User avatar
iamgoat
Metal God
Posts: 5814
Joined: 13 Apr 2009, 14:44
Location: a mountain somewhere

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby iamgoat » 21 Oct 2017, 00:32

I'm sure Erik Rutan is aware of those techniques, Shredlord. ;) and those are just possible recording ways out of many.
:grimb:
User avatar
Shredlord
Ancient One
Posts: 1617
Joined: 16 Apr 2009, 20:07

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Shredlord » 21 Oct 2017, 02:48

Then why doesn't he use them? Oh, maybe he likes that thin, buzzy, inarticulate guitar sound. ;)
User avatar
Taurean Mixing
God of Emptiness
Posts: 527
Joined: 17 Apr 2009, 10:08
Contact:

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Taurean Mixing » 21 Oct 2017, 03:20

To my ear, it sounds like over eq'ing. Especially with Neve 1073 eq's or similar.
User avatar
iamgoat
Metal God
Posts: 5814
Joined: 13 Apr 2009, 14:44
Location: a mountain somewhere

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby iamgoat » 21 Oct 2017, 05:21

Shredlord wrote:Then why doesn't he use them? Oh, maybe he likes that thin, buzzy, inarticulate guitar sound. ;)


Were you there with him during recording? Then you can't say this or that happened. You have no idea what kind of processing went on during the mix either. Only if you had a close relationship with the raw audio and what went on during tracking and mixing, could you possibly make such statements.

And Taurean, that EQ'ing you are hearing could also be anything. Could be a plugin, could be a 1073 or 1081 EQ. Whatever! Could be the direct eq from the amp heads in combination with whatever guitars and other amps and effects were used... could be a certain mic or mic combination. Or maybe even the mixbus processing! Maybe there was some M/S eqing happening with Brainworx digital_v3 for all I care. Or maybe the guitar bus had a certain tube compressor on it. A Fairchild in Lat/Vert mode! WHO THE FUCK KNOWS!
:grimb:
User avatar
Verbal
Postwhore
Posts: 20730
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 03:05

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Verbal » 21 Oct 2017, 05:30

yea it could just be a microchip speaker 124QRS rerouted through a quantum RIPCORD plugin with fruital feedback
User avatar
Taurean Mixing
God of Emptiness
Posts: 527
Joined: 17 Apr 2009, 10:08
Contact:

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Taurean Mixing » 21 Oct 2017, 06:23

iamgoat wrote:
Shredlord wrote:Then why doesn't he use them? Oh, maybe he likes that thin, buzzy, inarticulate guitar sound. ;)


Were you there with him during recording? Then you can't say this or that happened. You have no idea what kind of processing went on during the mix either. Only if you had a close relationship with the raw audio and what went on during tracking and mixing, could you possibly make such statements.

And Taurean, that EQ'ing you are hearing could also be anything. Could be a plugin, could be a 1073 or 1081 EQ. Whatever! Could be the direct eq from the amp heads in combination with whatever guitars and other amps and effects were used... could be a certain mic or mic combination. Or maybe even the mixbus processing! Maybe there was some M/S eqing happening with Brainworx digital_v3 for all I care. Or maybe the guitar bus had a certain tube compressor on it. A Fairchild in Lat/Vert mode! WHO THE FUCK KNOWS!


lol :krinor: Dude calmeth downeth. Of course none of us truly know, we weren't there but that's the point of my post, it's an educated guess: I'm diagnosing what I believe to be the driving culprit behind that specific guitar tone anomaly. It's implicit we weren't there! My guess is based on what I'm hearing, my experience, and what I purport to know as a consequence based on some variable. I'm not just willy nilly throwing some vague idea out there for fun. On top of that, I'm sure there are other variables too but it's that specific over the top neve 73 eq'ing I am pin-pointing. The idea that it could be a plugin or hardware is totally irrelevant UNLESS, if you have audio experience, you can establish why you think it's that. I'm specifically saying it's not just any eq'ing. I'm stressing and asserting that it's a neve style, over eqing on the guitar. I wasn't asking with ambiguity. That's my perspective and opinion based on experience.
User avatar
iamgoat
Metal God
Posts: 5814
Joined: 13 Apr 2009, 14:44
Location: a mountain somewhere

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby iamgoat » 21 Oct 2017, 11:41

Verbal wrote:yea it could just be a microchip speaker 124QRS rerouted through a quantum RIPCORD plugin with fruital feedback


Nooooo that's just silly!
:grimb:
User avatar
iamgoat
Metal God
Posts: 5814
Joined: 13 Apr 2009, 14:44
Location: a mountain somewhere

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine p

Postby iamgoat » 21 Oct 2017, 11:49

Taurean Mixing wrote:
lol :krinor: Dude calmeth downeth. Of course none of us truly know, we weren't there but that's the point of my post, it's an educated guess: I'm diagnosing what I believe to be the driving culprit behind that specific guitar tone anomaly. It's implicit we weren't there! My guess is based on what I'm hearing, my experience, and what I purport to know as a consequence based on some variable. I'm not just willy nilly throwing some vague idea out there for fun. On top of that, I'm sure there are other variables too but it's that specific over the top neve 73 eq'ing I am pin-pointing. The idea that it could be a plugin or hardware is totally irrelevant UNLESS, if you have audio experience, you can establish why you think it's that. I'm specifically saying it's not just any eq'ing. I'm stressing and asserting that it's a neve style, over eqing on the guitar. I wasn't asking with ambiguity. That's my perspective and opinion based on experience.


I guess I've witnessed too many internet discussions and fights about audio that I've become allergic to statements about a production process one wasn't part of but because there is no filter on the internet and everybody has the same level of autonomy and "experience" it becomes a meaningless debate. There is SO MUCH misinformation out there when it comes to this line of work, my work, that it's becoming harder and harder to find facts and helpful information. I've always loved the way of how The Womb Forums by Mixerman would tackle that spreading of misinformation right away and not let that shit have any place in our community. Now every so called Producah has a youtube channel, a mailinglist and paid tutorials on "10 MIXING MISTAKES YOU DIDN'T KNOW YOU WERE MAKING!" from people who have never even got any real records out. As if they know all the little secrets to making it as a producah as long as you pay them your hard earned money. Oh right! Money that doesn't come by very often in this business to begin with.

ANYYYYYWAY:

But what makes you say it's a 1073? I've got two hardware 1073's (AML) and the Scheps 73 plugin. First thing that I always hear is when you turn up that 60, 80 or 110 Hz it enriches the low end in a flattering way but can be pushed over its limit quite quickly. That's why I love the preamp saturation it can give to give it more harmonic distortion. I just really like the frequency settings on a 1073 style eq because those are the freq's that I love boosting. I almost never cut freqs with a 1073. And this eq didn't come to my mind when I heard those guitars. Except for that low end that it could have gotten a little too much of.

P.S.- I know Rutan loves his Neve pre's and EQ's but that shouldn't be reason enough to think that made this guitar sound. Just sayin'.

:santa:
:grimb:
User avatar
Hitoshura
Metal God
Posts: 18538
Joined: 17 Apr 2009, 04:24

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Hitoshura » 21 Oct 2017, 12:25

i have a 2i2 and a synthesizer and actually here's why all of you are all wrong about all this
User avatar
TamPron
Metal God
Posts: 16567
Joined: 24 Apr 2009, 00:50
Location: Rod Stewart
Contact:

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby TamPron » 21 Oct 2017, 12:29

Hitoshura wrote:i have a 2i2 and a synthesizer and actually here's why all of you are all wrong about all this


Go on..
User avatar
Nick
Postwhore
Posts: 49979
Joined: 26 Jul 2009, 22:32
Location: the bottle dump

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Nick » 21 Oct 2017, 19:32

Stormy with the click bait post
vega wrote:But when I am meeting she is a round circle like egg. :oldryan: . She is eating 88% of foods and I am paying 100% bill.


Ninny wrote:But I've never seen a fat sexy leopard elevator naked, what do I do when I'm not aroused?
User avatar
Taurean Mixing
God of Emptiness
Posts: 527
Joined: 17 Apr 2009, 10:08
Contact:

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine p

Postby Taurean Mixing » 21 Oct 2017, 23:14

iamgoat wrote:
Taurean Mixing wrote:
lol :krinor: Dude calmeth downeth. Of course none of us truly know, we weren't there but that's the point of my post, it's an educated guess: I'm diagnosing what I believe to be the driving culprit behind that specific guitar tone anomaly. It's implicit we weren't there! My guess is based on what I'm hearing, my experience, and what I purport to know as a consequence based on some variable. I'm not just willy nilly throwing some vague idea out there for fun. On top of that, I'm sure there are other variables too but it's that specific over the top neve 73 eq'ing I am pin-pointing. The idea that it could be a plugin or hardware is totally irrelevant UNLESS, if you have audio experience, you can establish why you think it's that. I'm specifically saying it's not just any eq'ing. I'm stressing and asserting that it's a neve style, over eqing on the guitar. I wasn't asking with ambiguity. That's my perspective and opinion based on experience.


I guess I've witnessed too many internet discussions and fights about audio that I've become allergic to statements about a production process one wasn't part of but because there is no filter on the internet and everybody has the same level of autonomy and "experience" it becomes a meaningless debate. There is SO MUCH misinformation out there when it comes to this line of work, my work, that it's becoming harder and harder to find facts and helpful information. I've always loved the way of how The Womb Forums by Mixerman would tackle that spreading of misinformation right away and not let that shit have any place in our community. Now every so called Producah has a youtube channel, a mailinglist and paid tutorials on "10 MIXING MISTAKES YOU DIDN'T KNOW YOU WERE MAKING!" from people who have never even got any real records out. As if they know all the little secrets to making it as a producah as long as you pay them your hard earned money. Oh right! Money that doesn't come by very often in this business to begin with.

ANYYYYYWAY:

But what makes you say it's a 1073? I've got two hardware 1073's (AML) and the Scheps 73 plugin. First thing that I always hear is when you turn up that 60, 80 or 110 Hz it enriches the low end in a flattering way but can be pushed over its limit quite quickly. That's why I love the preamp saturation it can give to give it more harmonic distortion. I just really like the frequency settings on a 1073 style eq because those are the freq's that I love boosting. I almost never cut freqs with a 1073. And this eq didn't come to my mind when I heard those guitars. Except for that low end that it could have gotten a little too much of.

P.S.- I know Rutan loves his Neve pre's and EQ's but that shouldn't be reason enough to think that made this guitar sound. Just sayin'.

:santa:

Oh I can relate to the internet discussions, and the podoocahz (lol I say that all the time to my gf), and the so-called experts, etc on and on. Over 15 years of this, and when subscribed on these forums, you see the best of it. There's no check and balance these days, so long as you have a net connection and YT channel, you're an "expert." My assessment as to why it's a Neve style is just my engineer's guess based on the sonic signature. To me it sounds like that flattering stuff that indeed went to far. You said it yourself. Neve sounds great and every time you inch it here and inch it there, you want more or you want more of what you cut out. And what happens is this phasey soupy thing that's actually fat, sludgy, and may be even a sonic thickness but not articulate; not necessarily in a pleasing way. Because I've cranked those things and cut so drastically it's just a sonic memory of sorts. I do know this, even if it turned out it's not a neve, there's no way it's NOT over-eq and/or processing in general, that much I absolutely know. If you were to over eq/process a sound to something less desirable versus dial in and mic up a sound less desirable, the mic'ed up sound will at least have dimension to it, movement, life, more likely than not over the eq/processed sound. The flattening, loss of clarity, and phase distortion to my ears is unique compared to a less desirable sound off the bat from strictly a recording.
User avatar
iamgoat
Metal God
Posts: 5814
Joined: 13 Apr 2009, 14:44
Location: a mountain somewhere

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine p

Postby iamgoat » 21 Oct 2017, 23:32

Taurean Mixing wrote:
iamgoat wrote:
Taurean Mixing wrote:
lol :krinor: Dude calmeth downeth. Of course none of us truly know, we weren't there but that's the point of my post, it's an educated guess: I'm diagnosing what I believe to be the driving culprit behind that specific guitar tone anomaly. It's implicit we weren't there! My guess is based on what I'm hearing, my experience, and what I purport to know as a consequence based on some variable. I'm not just willy nilly throwing some vague idea out there for fun. On top of that, I'm sure there are other variables too but it's that specific over the top neve 73 eq'ing I am pin-pointing. The idea that it could be a plugin or hardware is totally irrelevant UNLESS, if you have audio experience, you can establish why you think it's that. I'm specifically saying it's not just any eq'ing. I'm stressing and asserting that it's a neve style, over eqing on the guitar. I wasn't asking with ambiguity. That's my perspective and opinion based on experience.


I guess I've witnessed too many internet discussions and fights about audio that I've become allergic to statements about a production process one wasn't part of but because there is no filter on the internet and everybody has the same level of autonomy and "experience" it becomes a meaningless debate. There is SO MUCH misinformation out there when it comes to this line of work, my work, that it's becoming harder and harder to find facts and helpful information. I've always loved the way of how The Womb Forums by Mixerman would tackle that spreading of misinformation right away and not let that shit have any place in our community. Now every so called Producah has a youtube channel, a mailinglist and paid tutorials on "10 MIXING MISTAKES YOU DIDN'T KNOW YOU WERE MAKING!" from people who have never even got any real records out. As if they know all the little secrets to making it as a producah as long as you pay them your hard earned money. Oh right! Money that doesn't come by very often in this business to begin with.

ANYYYYYWAY:

But what makes you say it's a 1073? I've got two hardware 1073's (AML) and the Scheps 73 plugin. First thing that I always hear is when you turn up that 60, 80 or 110 Hz it enriches the low end in a flattering way but can be pushed over its limit quite quickly. That's why I love the preamp saturation it can give to give it more harmonic distortion. I just really like the frequency settings on a 1073 style eq because those are the freq's that I love boosting. I almost never cut freqs with a 1073. And this eq didn't come to my mind when I heard those guitars. Except for that low end that it could have gotten a little too much of.

P.S.- I know Rutan loves his Neve pre's and EQ's but that shouldn't be reason enough to think that made this guitar sound. Just sayin'.

:santa:

Oh I can relate to the internet discussions, and the podoocahz (lol I say that all the time to my gf), and the so-called experts, etc on and on. Over 15 years of this, and when subscribed on these forums, you see the best of it. There's no check and balance these days, so long as you have a net connection and YT channel, you're an "expert." My assessment as to why it's a Neve style is just my engineer's guess based on the sonic signature. To me it sounds like that flattering stuff that indeed went to far. You said it yourself. Neve sounds great and every time you inch it here and inch it there, you want more or you want more of what you cut out. And what happens is this phasey soupy thing that's actually fat, sludgy, and may be even a sonic thickness but not articulate; not necessarily in a pleasing way. Because I've cranked those things and cut so drastically it's just a sonic memory of sorts. I do know this, even if it turned out it's not a neve, there's no way it's NOT over-eq and/or processing in general, that much I absolutely know. If you were to over eq/process a sound to something less desirable versus dial in and mic up a sound less desirable, the mic'ed up sound will at least have dimension to it, movement, life, more likely than not over the eq/processed sound. The flattening, loss of clarity, and phase distortion to my ears is unique compared to a less desirable sound off the bat from strictly a recording.


You make a good point there. I like a 1073 on vocals, snares and acoustic stuff. Not so much on electric guitars. API's, or the Kush Audio Electra, are better with more drastic curves as they are proportional; higher gain is a narrower slope/Q. less phase distortion.

I'm going to have a very good listen to the cd version.
:grimb:
zim
Postwhore
Posts: 20401
Joined: 14 Apr 2009, 02:36
Location: US

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby zim » 22 Oct 2017, 04:35

TamPron wrote:
Hitoshura wrote:i have a 2i2 and a synthesizer and actually here's why all of you are all wrong about all this


Go on..


holy shit it's like i'm on metalsucks.net :redneck: :redneck:
User avatar
Shredlord
Ancient One
Posts: 1617
Joined: 16 Apr 2009, 20:07

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Shredlord » 22 Oct 2017, 05:33

The internet: Where else can you argue with strangers about trivial matters?
User avatar
Verbal
Postwhore
Posts: 20730
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 03:05

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Verbal » 22 Oct 2017, 06:30

literally anywhere there are strangers or means to communicate with them
User avatar
Shredlord
Ancient One
Posts: 1617
Joined: 16 Apr 2009, 20:07

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby Shredlord » 22 Oct 2017, 13:16

Verbal wrote:literally anywhere there are strangers or means to communicate with them

I should have added by being cowardly anonymous and also avoiding getting punched in the face. :)
zim
Postwhore
Posts: 20401
Joined: 14 Apr 2009, 02:36
Location: US

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby zim » 22 Oct 2017, 13:21

i'd like to see NDMG get punched in that face
User avatar
TamPron
Metal God
Posts: 16567
Joined: 24 Apr 2009, 00:50
Location: Rod Stewart
Contact:

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby TamPron » 22 Oct 2017, 14:36

I'd like to shit his pants.
User avatar
Taurean Mixing
God of Emptiness
Posts: 527
Joined: 17 Apr 2009, 10:08
Contact:

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine p

Postby Taurean Mixing » 22 Oct 2017, 22:31

iamgoat wrote:
Taurean Mixing wrote:
iamgoat wrote:
Taurean Mixing wrote:
lol :krinor: Dude calmeth downeth. Of course none of us truly know, we weren't there but that's the point of my post, it's an educated guess: I'm diagnosing what I believe to be the driving culprit behind that specific guitar tone anomaly. It's implicit we weren't there! My guess is based on what I'm hearing, my experience, and what I purport to know as a consequence based on some variable. I'm not just willy nilly throwing some vague idea out there for fun. On top of that, I'm sure there are other variables too but it's that specific over the top neve 73 eq'ing I am pin-pointing. The idea that it could be a plugin or hardware is totally irrelevant UNLESS, if you have audio experience, you can establish why you think it's that. I'm specifically saying it's not just any eq'ing. I'm stressing and asserting that it's a neve style, over eqing on the guitar. I wasn't asking with ambiguity. That's my perspective and opinion based on experience.


I guess I've witnessed too many internet discussions and fights about audio that I've become allergic to statements about a production process one wasn't part of but because there is no filter on the internet and everybody has the same level of autonomy and "experience" it becomes a meaningless debate. There is SO MUCH misinformation out there when it comes to this line of work, my work, that it's becoming harder and harder to find facts and helpful information. I've always loved the way of how The Womb Forums by Mixerman would tackle that spreading of misinformation right away and not let that shit have any place in our community. Now every so called Producah has a youtube channel, a mailinglist and paid tutorials on "10 MIXING MISTAKES YOU DIDN'T KNOW YOU WERE MAKING!" from people who have never even got any real records out. As if they know all the little secrets to making it as a producah as long as you pay them your hard earned money. Oh right! Money that doesn't come by very often in this business to begin with.

ANYYYYYWAY:

But what makes you say it's a 1073? I've got two hardware 1073's (AML) and the Scheps 73 plugin. First thing that I always hear is when you turn up that 60, 80 or 110 Hz it enriches the low end in a flattering way but can be pushed over its limit quite quickly. That's why I love the preamp saturation it can give to give it more harmonic distortion. I just really like the frequency settings on a 1073 style eq because those are the freq's that I love boosting. I almost never cut freqs with a 1073. And this eq didn't come to my mind when I heard those guitars. Except for that low end that it could have gotten a little too much of.

P.S.- I know Rutan loves his Neve pre's and EQ's but that shouldn't be reason enough to think that made this guitar sound. Just sayin'.

:santa:

Oh I can relate to the internet discussions, and the podoocahz (lol I say that all the time to my gf), and the so-called experts, etc on and on. Over 15 years of this, and when subscribed on these forums, you see the best of it. There's no check and balance these days, so long as you have a net connection and YT channel, you're an "expert." My assessment as to why it's a Neve style is just my engineer's guess based on the sonic signature. To me it sounds like that flattering stuff that indeed went to far. You said it yourself. Neve sounds great and every time you inch it here and inch it there, you want more or you want more of what you cut out. And what happens is this phasey soupy thing that's actually fat, sludgy, and may be even a sonic thickness but not articulate; not necessarily in a pleasing way. Because I've cranked those things and cut so drastically it's just a sonic memory of sorts. I do know this, even if it turned out it's not a neve, there's no way it's NOT over-eq and/or processing in general, that much I absolutely know. If you were to over eq/process a sound to something less desirable versus dial in and mic up a sound less desirable, the mic'ed up sound will at least have dimension to it, movement, life, more likely than not over the eq/processed sound. The flattening, loss of clarity, and phase distortion to my ears is unique compared to a less desirable sound off the bat from strictly a recording.


You make a good point there. I like a 1073 on vocals, snares and acoustic stuff. Not so much on electric guitars. API's, or the Kush Audio Electra, are better with more drastic curves as they are proportional; higher gain is a narrower slope/Q. less phase distortion.

I'm going to have a very good listen to the cd version.


I know what you mean. Those other EQ's can be laser focus compared to the 73. One turn of a frequency with the 73 and it's like several octaves are affected and it can really color such bandwidth. Not that that's always bad. I've found use for them on guitars actually as finishing touches for example, may be 3/4, usually less, of a dB on a given freq.
User avatar
morbid board eli
Postwhore
Posts: 68743
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 07:36

Re: Sam Bean review from Zero Tolerance Magazine

Postby morbid board eli » 23 Oct 2017, 19:16

Image

Return to “The Chapel”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest